Newbie Question

[vman]

Does anyone know what class a stock 1999 porsche 996 would run on sunday...the only mods are GT-3 sway bars, Bilstein adjustible PSS9 kit (shocks and springs), and 285 rear Street tires DOT 200?

Thanks in advance.

VMAN

[woodrufj]

ASP is the national class, due to the mods.

IS1 is a local class that is more restricted than ASP.

Either way, lots of vettes.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota

[vman]

Thanks so IS1 it is...does my wife have to run is1L, or can she just run IS1 as a novice? Where can I find the rules for the IS1 classification, I just finished reading the national rules for asp?

Thanks

[woodrufj]

IS classes are local only. So the rules are in the supplemental regulations (local rules). The sup regs were promised to be put online back in 2004. (How's that going guys?).

For the most part, the modification rules are STS (as found in the national rule book), plus any DOT tire, and rims up to 1.5" over stock. IS1 is for cars that would go to ASP, BSP or ESP.

[vman]

Last couple of questions

1) can my wife run in the men's class?

2) How do I find out what numbers are available, I need to have some made?

3) What is the sizing for the numbers and class stickers and how many do I have to have made...

4) where do the class stickers and numbers go on the car?

Thanks again.

[cshodges]

1) can my wife run in the men's class?
Yes, I believe so. As I understand it, the L classes are designed for this situation so your and your wife can be in different run groups. You can, however, enter as a 2-driver car for the same class. I could be wrong.

2) How do I find out what numbers are available, I need to have some made?
Show up and look in the book on April 2nd when you buy your SDR card. For a $1 donation, you can get paper numbers at Tech for that day, and worry about nice numbers for the next event. Or donate another $1 at the next event, as well. Even if you could contact someone and get a list of available numbers, that's no guarantee that someone else doesn't buy that number before you. Number cards are only sold at the events.

3) What is the sizing for the numbers and class stickers and how many do I have to have made...
The rulebook available online contains all the gory details. There are also rules regarding colors and placement of the numbers (see Section 3.7).

Numbers must be a minimum of 8" high with a 1.25" stroke.
Class letters must be a minimum of 4" high with a 0.75" stroke.
In all cases, the height of the class letters must be between 25%
and 75% of the height of the numbers. Stroke width must be at
least 10% of the height. Rulebook: http://www.scca.com/_filelibrary/File/2006_solo_rules.pdf

4) where do the class stickers and numbers go on the car?
On any body panel, not on the windows. The rulebook has lovely sample pictures in Appendix F.

[woodrufj]

1) can my wife run in the men's class?
Yes. Technically there are no 'men's' classes, just Open and Ladies. Women are more than welcome to run open. At a regional level about half the women run open.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota

[LTDScott]

Will I be able to purchase temp numbers for the car at the practice on Saturday?

[woodrufj]

Will I be able to purchase temp numbers for the car at the practice on Saturday?
The same tech box should be there on Saturday with paper numbers in it.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota

[KenH]

I'm new to this autocross thing. I've done two events with an RX-8 (in BS), in absolutely "showroom stock" trim. The first event it didn't even have plates. I'm wanting set it up for BS competition, rather than just throughing it around the course chuncking my full-depth showroom tires, but I'm a bit lost.

What I've done:
Have a set of Cumo V710s and new wheels on order. (Hope they get here for the July 1 school.)

What I plan to do, and think I have a handle on:
Realign the car to:
- as much negative camber as I can get (I'm told I can probably hit 2-deg. neg., all around -- we'll see.)
- zero toe rear
- 1/8 (total) toe-out front (measured at wheel rim)
These specs sound okay? Any other opinions out there?

What I understand I'm allowed to do, but haven't got a clue where to start:
- Koni (?) two-way adjustable shocks. What Koni shocks? How do I get my stock springs onto the new shocks? [I understand I cannot change, the springs, ride height, or do weight jacking. True??]
- I understand I can change the front anti-sway bar. To what? I'm thinking I want go go softer because the car tends to understeer now, and I'm not allowed to stiffen the rear, but, am I off base?. Does one fabricate this anti-sway bar, or are there vendors out there that have off-the-shelf items for an RX-8?


Anyone have any advice??

And, how come in Solo "Stock" doesn't mean "stock" -- as in the way you drive it off the showroom floor?

R/KenH

[jason]

What I've done:
Have a set of Cumo V710s and new wheels on order. (Hope they get here for the July 1 school.)



That was fast. :D BTW, it's spelled Kumho. Did you order OEM rims? If not, you need to make sure they are stock size (18 x 8) and within .25" of the stock offset (50mm) to stay in B-stock.



Realign the car to:
- as much negative camber as I can get (I'm told I can probably hit 2-deg. neg., all around -- we'll see.)
- zero toe rear
- 1/8 (total) toe-out front (measured at wheel rim)
These specs sound okay? Any other opinions out there?


This sounds pretty good, although it's doubtful you'll be able to get 2 degrees in the front. You'll get 1.5 if you're lucky. There are a lot of opinions on alignment. Some people prefer to run less camber in the rear to help the car rotate.



What I understand I'm allowed to do, but haven't got a clue where to start:
- Koni (?) two-way adjustable shocks. What Koni shocks? How do I get my stock springs onto the new shocks?


Shocks won't make a huge difference, but they will stabilize the car a bit and help with body roll. I, like most, are using off-the-shelf Koni sports. They are single-adjustable in that you can adjust the rebound. You can have them converted to double-adjustables for big bucks. You're right, you can't change the springs or ride height in stock class. The Konis are OEM size. Installation just involves removing the spring/shock assemblies and putting the stock springs on the new shocks.



I understand I can change the front anti-sway bar. To what? I'm thinking I want go go softer because the car tends to understeer now, and I'm not allowed to stiffen the rear, but, am I off base?. Does one fabricate this anti-sway bar, or are there vendors out there that have off-the-shelf items for an RX-8?


There are plenty of aftermarket sway bar options for the RX-8, although I don't think I've ever seen one softer than stock. If you're getting a lot of understeer with the stock bar, you may need a driving adjustment first. Seriously though, I would hold off on this until you try the V710s out. The car drives a lot differently than with the crappy OEM tires.



And, how come in Solo "Stock" doesn't mean "stock" -- as in the way you drive it off the showroom floor?


Don't bother asking, SCCA classing rules defy logic. :)

If you haven't already, you should definitely check out rx8club.com. Specifically the Competition/Racing and Suspension forums. This stuff has been discussed ad nauseum there. Also, I will be at the 7/1 school if you want to talk more. There's always something new to learn.

[frosty]

Don't bother asking, SCCA classing rules defy logic. :)


Sadly, too true. :confused:

[MX5bob]

If you think about, R compound tires, front swaybar change, drop-in airfilter, cat-back exhaust and shock absorbers [which if spend big $ become a sub for stiffer springs] all have something of an eqaulizing effect.

Some cars are pretty competitive right out of the box, but others would be useless. By allowing a small set of modifications, a mediocre car can be made competitive. That opens the sport to people who don't want to own what would be one of a few competitive cars if no mods were allowed.

The most expensive one-time expense in Stock is shock absorbers, but you don't need the Penske double-adjustables unless you're gunning for a Nationals win.

Street Touring classes, which run on tires with a tread wear rating of 140 or above allow much freedom for modifications and are the fastest growing classes. That's one-notch above Stock.

Beyond that, Street Prepared [don't be fooled by the word "Street"], Prepared and Modified are much more expensive and involved.

[jason]

Another point, that I think Randy made on the CalClub site, is that the mods allowed in stock are mostly wear items that you would replace eventually anyways. I.E. Tires, shocks, air filter.

It would really suck if we could only use OEM tires. You'd be severly limiting the car based on what tire the manufacturer chose to put on, and you'd have to find those same tires everytime you needed new ones. Not practical IMO.

The front anti-sway bar allowance I think is there to allow for a cheap way to address handling issues that some cars may have out of the box.

[frosty]

Another point, that I think Randy made on the CalClub site, is that the mods allowed in stock are mostly wear items that you would replace eventually anyways. I.E. Tires, shocks, air filter.


Agreed.



It would really suck if we could only use OEM tires. You'd be severly limiting the car based on what tire the manufacturer chose to put on, and you'd have to find those same tires everytime you needed new ones. Not practical IMO.


I agree that OEM only would be a joke. But I would like to see the treadwear rating restriction seen in ST classes. When you see "Stock", you assume that a nationally competitive car should be daily drivable with the same setup (including tires).



The front anti-sway bar allowance I think is there to allow for a cheap way to address handling issues that some cars may have out of the box.


I heard this was allowed because of concern for rollovers. I don't think it's as much of an issue with new cars today. But if you imagine cars from detroit back in the 60s and 70s doing autox (not the mustangs, the malibus and whatnot), they have a rather high center of gravity.